Fort Hood Tragedy

[tarheel]

I think it is unfortunate that this thread was stopped. This is a very important issue worthy of discussion. It was removed from Public Safety which is where it probably belongs, rather than here in Politics, but if the admins want it here, so be it.

I am personally tired of the political correctness on this matter. Everyone, and I do mean seemingly everyone, is running around acting like the biggest issue is not to offend Muslims. From all reports I have seen, this murderer gave plenty of indications that he was an Islamic extremist, with terrorist ties. These were overlooked because of politically correct motivations. This has got to stop. If a Muslim is issuing threats and indicating that non-believers should "be beheaded and have boiling oil poured down their throats," (as has been reported) then take care of business and make no apologies.

I repeat, I still think this is a Public Safety issue and not Politics. This turned out to be a Major on a military installation. It could just have easily been a Muslim civilian in a packed cafeteria.

And, yes, there are nuts of all colors and religious persuasions, but this one happened to be shouting Islamic fanatical language. So, let's not try to pretend it is not so.

[Webmaster]

Tarheel,

The original thread was started because the original poster wanted a place to talk about the grieving families, express support for the Fort Hood community, etc. It was not started as a place to lay blame or discuss the President's handling of the situation or what could or should have been done to prevent it. That's why one of the moderators closed the thread when it was clearly becoming a political discussion. Where threads are placed is at the discretion of the moderators or myself.

[tarheel]

Webmaster, no issues, I completely agree.

My thrust in starting this was that it seems we need to know if the Major was giving indications that he was an Islamic extremist with violent intentions. If so, did the officers in charge overlook it due to politically correct reasons, thereby almost directly causing the deaths of these soldiers? It seems to me that there should be no difference in Timothy McVeigh and Nidal Malik Hasan. If someone had any indication of what they were planning, then that needs to be handled quickly and seriously. No color, race, or religion should be allowed as any kind of excuse for anarchism or terrorism.

[tonigking]

Tarheel, I absolutely agree. I am sick to death of "political correctness". It comes straight out of D.C., but already they are looking to lay the blame on the Military Commanders. They are ****ed if they do and ****ed if they don't.
The Military follows orders, period. All the way from the top, to the Commander in Chief.
Doesn't the Military have enough on their hands without trying to scramble to cover thier butts while dealing with this mess?
The blame game by politicians, special interest groups and left-wing media sickens me.

God Bless our Military, Thank you for all you do!

[KINGCHIP]

I just hope that a jury of his peers puts him away for life and a dark day. to execute him would raise him to martyr status for the extremist to feed off of. Let him rot in Leavenworth.

[grumpy]

It was an act of muslim terrorism. Pure and simple. Trying to call it something else through political correctness is an embarrassment to all concerned. And we had better all be concerned.

[Caretaker]

I dont consider it Terrorism. I think it is War and The radicals are using guerrilla war tactics and infiltration as their main arsenal..Oh and I,m sorry for not being Politically correct.Just seems to me that the common link to our problem is the enemy is with in.:cool:

What really erks me is that with in a very short time period our investigators knew awfully fast all this Info about this guy.How did they get it so fast? And if they already Knew of his activitys then WHY did they Not discharge him or ship him off to siberia or something? :banghead:

[Peaches]

I say give him his martyrdom. Why should his beliefs cause him to not be executed?

[KINGCHIP]

No, No, that's not it at all. The extremists seem to thrive on dying for the cause. If he is executed, it is considered a triumph by that group. So I think he should rot in the Leavenworth Hilton and deprive him and his kind from the perceived victory. Life and a dark day would suit me fine.

[salspecht53]

Two thumbs up, KINGCHIP! I'm with ya.

Sally

[countryboy]

No, No, that's not it at all. The extremists seem to thrive on dying for the cause. If he is executed, it is considered a triumph by that group. So I think he should rot in the Leavenworth Hilton and deprive him and his kind from the perceived victory. Life and a dark day would suit me fine.


Kingchip.I like that but I will up it one.. Seeing as they believe they will get 72 virgins in the after life. Lets just put him in the dark cell with 72 gay virgins. :rolleyes: Let the joke be on him.

Please dont say a word a the gay joke.. I,m Not politically correct either.;)

[KINGCHIP]

Kingchip.I like that but I will up it one.. Seeing as they believe they will get 72 virgins in the after life. Lets just put him in the dark cell with 72 gay virgins. :rolleyes: Let the joke be on him.

Please dont say a word a the gay joke.. I,m Not politically correct either.;)


I'm not touching part of your post, but have to comment on the other. That whatever number of virgins thing that they........hope for, or are promised or whatever. I work with about 15 females now, and that is a handful. What exactly are they thinking? No offense intended towards any of the ladies that will eventually read this . I'm guessing that too many of either opposite gender would be a bit much.

[lmam88]

"Seeing as they believe they will get 72 virgins in the after life."

Are you serious?

[KINGCHIP]

I don't know the numbers but it has been reported that some number of virgins awaits you whereever it is you go after a suicide bombing or other similar such act.

[Peaches]

No, he needs to suffer that long, slow wait on death row just like all the others - thinking about all those virgins he thinks he's going to get (but won't!). Then, after all appeals are exhausted (and you know he's going to appeal), they need to insert that needle into his arm and let the chemicals go to work.

Of course that is just my knee-jerk reaction/opinion. When it comes right down to it, I will support the wishes of the victims' family members first and foremost.

[salspecht53]

My earlier post suggested "mental illness" was behind this heinous act. Since then, the additional information brought forth by the news media has convnced me this was an act of Islamic terrorism.

Kingchip: I agree with you - what is the big draw of a) virgins and b) 72 of them??? (yikes)

I did a little web searching, and found this explanation, posted by a Muslim when the question was posed to ask where this notion originated:
-----
"The Prophet Muhammad was heard saying: 'The smallest reward for the people of paradise is an abode where there are 80,000 servants and 72 wives, over which stands a dome decorated with pearls, aquamarine, and ruby, as wide as the distance from Al-Jabiyah [a Damascus suburb] to Sana'a [Yemen]."

So it isn't the case that only martyrs get the virgins, but the only way to get the virgins is to get to heaven, and Koran is quite specific that the only way to be certain of getting to heaven is to die in Jihad.
-----
The above was found here: http://www.e-thepeople.org/article/58474/view?viewtype=best

We are told that Islam preaches peace, but that message gets lost in the sensationalism of a brutal terrorist act in the name of Islam. The individuals who carry out "jihad" are the ones who get all the attention in the press, and therefore damage our perception of many good people.

So, now we have a dilemma: how can Muslims in the military come to terms with their religious beliefs and the 2 wars in which the military is currently engaged? Can the military trust their Muslim members?

[Peaches]

Thanks for the research, Sally. I knew about the "72 virgins" thing, but this was an excellent explaination. I now understand where the confusion begins with the number 72 - apparently 72 virgins are part of the smallest reward for the people of Paradise. There could be many, many more.

But, I think we put ourselves in a dilemma when we make judicial decisions based upon a person's religious beliefs. In this county we have Separation of Church and State - and we must fight to protect that separation. We cannot allow ourselves, our laws, and our country to be held hostage by the Koran (or any other religious writings).

We must address the criminal element. Pure and simple.

As for Muslims in the military, again we have the Separation of Chuch and State to consider. Can we keep people out of the military based solely on their religion? No. Can we keep them out of the military because they're crazy and don't belong there? Absolutely!

This guy had lost it - he had become a fanatic over his religious beliefs. He would have committed this kind of terroristic act even if he hadn't been in the military. That thought scares me to death.

If there is something good to come from this tragedy it will be the lessons we've learned about religious fanaticism and maybe how to deal with it...

[tonigking]

Levenworth is the answer. Put him in there with a bunch of bad boys hopelessly trying to redeem themselves. They'll handle it.

[Karenw66]

He was formally charged yesterday. And they are still debating whether to charge him with the death of Pvt. Velez's unborn child.

From AP >> "Hasan was charged Thursday with 13 counts of premeditated murder in the attack at the sprawling Texas post that also left 29 people injured. The Army psychiatrist was shot several times and remains hospitalized. He could face the death penalty if convicted."

Also, in regards to some of the earlier post about the 72 "Virgils" >>

"The attorney for the Army psychiatrist accused of killing fellow soldiers at Fort Hood says doctors have told the soldier he may be paralyzed from the waist down. Attorney John Galligan told The Associated Press on Friday that Maj. Nidal Malik Hasan told him that he has no feeling in his legs and doctors say the condition may be permanent."

I'm just sayin' ...:rolleyes:

[tarheel]

Dr. Krauthammer has put it better than I ever could. Here is an excerpt: What a surprise -- that someone who shouts "Allahu Akbar" (the "God is great" jihadist battle cry) as he is shooting up a room of American soldiers might have Islamist motives. It certainly was a surprise to the mainstream media, which spent the weekend after the Fort Hood massacre downplaying Nidal Hasan's religious beliefs.

Read it all at:
http://townhall.com/Common/PrintPage.aspx?g=153ac19c-2050-4195-9e62-f00f6fa07731&t=c

A very good read.