Term Limits

[Peaches]

I have some thoughts on term limits, both pro and con. I'm just not sure I'm sold on limiting terms to all positions at the Federal Government level.

Your thoughts?

[tonigking]

I am absolutely in favor of term limits.

All government level positions are determined by the incumbents in elected offices.

The worker bees keep an agency stable. The directors (top management) take their que from whomever , individual/party , is in the elected office.

So kicking out the elected incompetents, personal agenda pros, gets the "in-laws" out of the "guvment" also.

Keeps the worker bees on their toes also, knowing every 4-8 years there's going to be new blood, new eyes.

The elected officials should have a reasonable budget to run their offices, not their campaigns, and there should be no salaries at all. Whatever happened to civic duty?

There should not be a lifetime pension/insurance for serving a term or two either!

There's my 2 pence:popcorn:

[Caretaker]

Make it a lottery system that has all competent and eligible voters names in a large fish bowl.. Make it the luck of the draw. Kind of like the jury system..Each county would have a rep or two reps from there area. The 1st round of names drawn would be for the senate.2nd round for congress.. Each member would only recieve minimal comp while in office..Once their term is up.They go home and with NO life time benefits.And They wont be allowed to have their names in the system until after sitting out at least one term.That would stop career politicians... In this type of a system. Civic duty maybe able to be brought back to Texas Or the USA which ever you prefer.

[curious]

This is all well and good. I agree 100%. But, how do we get this done? It would have to legislated by the exact ones we are trying to limit!

[Wrangler]

The President of the US (POTUS) has a constitutional term limit. I agree w/Toni there should be no reason NOT to have term limits for Senators or Representatives. Similarly that should apply to state offices as well as local offices. Most county commissioners think their job is "life long" and it frequently is!

I read an interesting article the other day wherein the writer said the problem (on the federal level) is that there we haven't made enough amendments to the US Constitution. His point was that the professional politicians have perverted the "system" by passing poorly drafted laws and then politicizing the judiciary to "intrepret" the laws (i.e make laws) according to their (the judges') political outlook. What we need, he said, is to change the law by constitution amendments rather by judicial decrees. Basically I think he has a point.

So to answer the question of "how do we institute change if the entrenched won't do it", the answer is Amend the Constitution. The states can do it. Read the Constitution and you will see the way to do it.

[countryboy]

Would that part be. The Right to ALTER or ABOLISH.

[mdarling]

You might want to check benefits for congress. They are not entitled to lifetime annuities for serving one or two terms.

[carvet44]

Wrangler, have you read the Texas constitution? The problem with it is, it's TOO LONG. The ONLY way to amend it is with another amendment. The beauty of the US constitution is that it doesn't require an amendment for every little action. The Texas constitution actually needs to be thrown out and completely re-written. That's a gargantuan task that will never be undertaken, it can only be added to. You should try to read it sometime - but I don't think you can. Nothing against you, BTW, very, very few people can. I have great respect for Texas attorneys who specialize in constitutional law. It's a huge task.

[gardener]

Just a question for those more learned than I in election and constitutional law.

Is it unrealistic to think that a petition to Congress by registered voters would
avail us nothing? Real petition, not internet, voters certified...

I just received an update from our local congressional representative which
addressed NONE of the concerns discussed by those at his town hall meetings
recently... Just the party line...

Can we actually reboot these representatives to represent US and not their party
line without term limits? I think not. Esoteric conversation will not accomplish
this, how do we DO IT FOR REAL! And do it now.

The only other alternative would be to vote out every incumbent, replaced with
an honest to goodness untainted real voting citizen, but how do you choose who
goes into your lottery..

[Wrangler]

Wrangler, have you read the Texas constitution? The problem with it is, it's TOO LONG. The ONLY way to amend it is with another amendment. The beauty of the US constitution is that it doesn't require an amendment for every little action. The Texas constitution actually needs to be thrown out and completely re-written. That's a gargantuan task that will never be undertaken, it can only be added to. You should try to read it sometime - but I don't think you can. Nothing against you, BTW, very, very few people can. I have great respect for Texas attorneys who specialize in constitutional law. It's a huge task.

You are correct that Texas constitution is too long BUT the history of "why" it is was to address the issue facing Texans at that time. This was post-civil war and carpetbaggers were in charge of Texas. So Texans at the 1st opportunity wrote a constitution that provided the means for the PEOPLE to over-ride the Governor or Legislature and that was to have a constitution that LIMITED government powers and forced the government to go to the people to get permission to do certain things. Texas constitutional amendments MUST be approved by the voters. Thus, this scheme gave the PEOPLE more control but results in a "messy" frequently amended constitution. But, better "hard to read" than have what we have with US Constiution where politicians purposely write vague laws knowing that a politicized federal judiciary will "make law" by their rulings. THAT IS THE POINT I AM TRYING TO MAKE!

We need to "override" the politicized federal courts when necessary by amending the US Constitution more often. That's my point!

The "beauty" of the US Constitution is that it currently has been abused by professional lifetime pol's. This is way certain judges find "penumbras" to justify their politicized rulings. (see http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/penumbra).

The PEOPLE should be able to overrule the US Supreme Court by amending the US Constitution rather than having activitist judges cram their politics down our throats by rulings.

[countryboy]

Wrangler, have you read the Texas constitution? The problem with it is, it's TOO LONG. The ONLY way to amend it is with another amendment. The beauty of the US constitution is that it doesn't require an amendment for every little action. The Texas constitution actually needs to be thrown out and completely re-written. That's a gargantuan task that will never be undertaken, it can only be added to. You should try to read it sometime - but I don't think you can. Nothing against you, BTW, very, very few people can. I have great respect for Texas attorneys who specialize in constitutional law. It's a huge task.


The best solution would be to use the 1836 Texas consititution and Throw out the US constitution.. Might as well since they arent using it as it was intended..:(

[Peaches]

Texas Courts don't always uphold the Constitution. If they would, there wouldn't be so many foreclosures in Texas. Mortgage companies that committed fraud should not be allowed to foreclose on properties if the victims can show fraud was committed. But...

[tonigking]

We must focus on State's Rights!

Problem is the States have sold themselves to the Devil (the feds) by accepting all the apples that are offered by the feds.

All the "free" money we get for pet projects through grants, low interest loans etc. keep us miserably obligated to the feds.

I saw a tee-shirt at lunch today that read;

"If at first you don't secede, try try again !";)

[tonigking]

THIS IS HOW YOU FIX CONGRESS!!!!!




A friend sent this along to me. I can't think of a reason to disagree.

I am sending this to virtually everybody on my e-mail list and that includes conservatives, liberals, and everybody in between. Even though we disagree on a number of issues, I count all of you as friends. My friend and neighbor wants to promote a "Congressional Reform Act of 2010." It would contain eight provisions, all of which would probably be strongly endorsed by those who drafted the Constitution and the Bill of Rights.

I know many of you will say "this is impossible." Let me remind you, Congress has the lowest approval rating of any entity in Government. Now is the time when Americans will join together to reform Congress - the entity that represents us.

We need to get a Senator to introduce this bill in the US Senate and a Representative to introduce a similar bill in the US House. These people will become American heroes


**********************************




Congressional Reform Act of 2010


1. Term Limits.
12 years only, one of the possible options below..

A. Two Six-year Senate terms
B. Six Two-year House terms
C. One Six-year Senate term and three Two-Year House terms


2. No Tenure / No Pension.

A Congressman collects a salary while in office and receives no pay when they are out of office.


3. Congress (past, present & future) participates in Social Security.

All funds in the Congressional retirement fund move to the Social Security system immediately. All future funds flow into the Social Security system, and Congress participates with the American people.


4. Congress can purchase their own retirement plan, just as all Americans do.


5. Congress will no longer vote themselves a pay raise. Congressional pay will rise by the lower of CPI or 3%.


6. Congress loses their current health care system and participates in the same health care system as the American people.

7. Congress must equally abide by all laws they impose on the American people.


8. All contracts with past and present Congressmen are void effective 1/1/11.

The American people did not make this contract with Congressmen. Congressmen made all these contracts for themselves.


Serving in Congress is an honor, not a career. The Founding Fathers envisioned citizen legislators, serve your term(s), then go home and back to work.

[gardener]

I like it, who will do it?

[Peaches]

THIS IS HOW YOU FIX CONGRESS!!!!!




A friend sent this along to me. I can't think of a reason to disagree.

I am sending this to virtually everybody on my e-mail list and that includes conservatives, liberals, and everybody in between. Even though we disagree on a number of issues, I count all of you as friends. My friend and neighbor wants to promote a "Congressional Reform Act of 2010." It would contain eight provisions, all of which would probably be strongly endorsed by those who drafted the Constitution and the Bill of Rights.

I know many of you will say "this is impossible." Let me remind you, Congress has the lowest approval rating of any entity in Government. Now is the time when Americans will join together to reform Congress - the entity that represents us.

We need to get a Senator to introduce this bill in the US Senate and a Representative to introduce a similar bill in the US House. These people will become American heroes


**********************************




Congressional Reform Act of 2010


1. Term Limits.
12 years only, one of the possible options below..

A. Two Six-year Senate terms
B. Six Two-year House terms
C. One Six-year Senate term and three Two-Year House terms


2. No Tenure / No Pension.

A Congressman collects a salary while in office and receives no pay when they are out of office.


3. Congress (past, present & future) participates in Social Security.

All funds in the Congressional retirement fund move to the Social Security system immediately. All future funds flow into the Social Security system, and Congress participates with the American people.


4. Congress can purchase their own retirement plan, just as all Americans do.


5. Congress will no longer vote themselves a pay raise. Congressional pay will rise by the lower of CPI or 3%.


6. Congress loses their current health care system and participates in the same health care system as the American people.

7. Congress must equally abide by all laws they impose on the American people.


8. All contracts with past and present Congressmen are void effective 1/1/11.

The American people did not make this contract with Congressmen. Congressmen made all these contracts for themselves.


Serving in Congress is an honor, not a career. The Founding Fathers envisioned citizen legislators, serve your term(s), then go home and back to work.

I agree with this plan. I just basically don't think career politicians work very hard in the interest of America.

But, would we end up with "lame duck" representatives if term limites are adopted?

And, would people still seek political positions if they know they can't be career politicians?

But, then again, on the other side, would we have BETTER people running because they are truely concerned citizens who want the best for our country?

Term limits or no, I absolutely agree that senators and congresspeople should live by the same standards they impose on others - including Social Security.

[tarheel]

I truly think the quality of our laws would be much better if we returned to the idea of citizen legislators. This is due to two facts. They would have come from a real world where they had to live under these laws, and they know they would have to return to that world and have to live under the laws they had created.

[tonigking]

WE THE PEOPLE...

We are the only ones that can fix it.

Please don't ask "who's going to fix it" Do what you can to fix it.

Men died and families destroyed to get IT, we must be willing to make some sacrifices too.

We didn't get in this mess over night and we won't fix it over. Now I don't suggest we take up arms but good grief the power of the pen, or computer as it were, is more powerful than guns.

If you are not a joiner, ie. Tea Party for instance, at least site your complaints in Memo form,(so you can easily change, add to)go to your address book make a group of all the Texas politicians that go to Washington and send your memo every day. Even if we only do it for our local elected officials, and yes I know you guys follow this forum, at least your aides do, we can make a difference and never leave home. John Cornyn (aides)answers every e-mail I send. I have had two personal phone calls from John himself.

Now keep in mind, even if you agree with what they are doing, as I do with Cornyn, send them file foder that they can use to persuade their colleagues. If you don't agree then let them have it over and over.

Be sure you send to both Dems and Reps.

And for the sake of America get out and vote and make sure a vote isn't lost because someone doesn't have a ride!