Public School or Home School

[curious]

OK, Folks. Let's hear it. . . . :popcorn:

[lmam88]

OK, Folks. Let's hear it. . . . :popcorn:
Would prefer to Homeschool as I firmly believe it is better for the kids especially this day and time. We tried it over the summer in fact but it just did not work real well for us this try. I am not going to give up completely on it though because when he reaches Middle School he WILL be Homeschooled.

Between more and more being expected of the Public Schools on so many levels I truly believe the kids are not getting a quality education. Teachers have to worry about teaching the TAKS Test, literally. Anything that is not on those tests falls by the wayside because the stakes for the kids and School District are just too high! With the classroom to teacher ratio being lifted it is going to be getting worse. More and more kids will be falling through the cracks, TAKS Test scores will fall and the Drop Out Rate will sky rocket.

Then there are the safety concerns that none of us ever want to think about but with more and more kids moving in from the larger cities it's not something that can be pushed away anymore. Gang related beatings and other tragic events against our area youth are indications it is already here so we cannot turn a blind eye to it anymore. It's good economically that our area is growing but it is sad that the small town security is disappearing...

[Peaches]

Don't home-schooled kids have to pass the TAKS also?

[Webmaster]

Don't home-schooled kids have to pass the TAKS also?
Nope.

[gardener]

imam88, all mine went to public school. As I had to work full time, it was a no choice situation for me. IF I had to do it over again, I would home school beginning at the start.
Starting at middle school would seem to be a too late intervention as they are set in the public school mindset and social scene well before 5th grade. Homeschooling as done by dear friends of mine worked well. They had a strict schedule each school day and get togethers with other home schoolers for p.e., sports and special occasions i.e. holiday parties, etc. However, home schooling as done by other acquaintances, went not so well.
It would seem it takes just as much of your time and involvement as a teacher as a full time job. Which your children are pretty much anyway. Working at home took so much of this mom's attention that her children took advantage and their education suffered.
As usual it would seem that you get out of it what you put into it.
Suggestion: Make a schedule on a poster board and keep the children on task with this schedule. Contact other home schoolers for workable lesson plans and seek out the older home schooling moms with teens who are successful and listen to them.
I hope you and your little ones do well, I will be praying for you.

[gardener]

PS, Imam 88, I went to google and searched our zip code with home school after and there is a wealth of info available. Of course, you must sift through and toos the chaff as well
See Texas Rules
http://ritter.tea.state.tx.us/home.school/index.html

[grumpy]

My kids went through public schools. All graduated from college and are either Medical Doctors or Engineers. It would appear to me that home schooling would deny them the social mix they will need in life.

[lmam88]

imam88, all mine went to public school. As I had to work full time, it was a no choice situation for me. IF I had to do it over again, I would home school beginning at the start.
Starting at middle school would seem to be a too late intervention as they are set in the public school mindset and social scene well before 5th grade. Homeschooling as done by dear friends of mine worked well. They had a strict schedule each school day and get togethers with other home schoolers for p.e., sports and special occasions i.e. holiday parties, etc. However, home schooling as done by other acquaintances, went not so well.
It would seem it takes just as much of your time and involvement as a teacher as a full time job. Which your children are pretty much anyway. Working at home took so much of this mom's attention that her children took advantage and their education suffered.
As usual it would seem that you get out of it what you put into it.
Suggestion: Make a schedule on a poster board and keep the children on task with this schedule. Contact other home schoolers for workable lesson plans and seek out the older home schooling moms with teens who are successful and listen to them.
I hope you and your little ones do well, I will be praying for you.
Thank you for the encouragement gardener! Like I said I am not going to give up. It has been our expereince through our older kids that Middle School is the start of the very hard years. Especially since all the kids from all elementary schools in the district are tunneled into one campus.

[lmam88]

My kids went through public schools. All graduated from college and are either Medical Doctors or Engineers. It would appear to me that home schooling would deny them the social mix they will need in life.

How long ago did your kids attend the Public Schools, grumpy? A lot has changed over the years! Our oldest graduated in 2004 and I can tell you a lot has changed just in the time since then. He was an honor student that hardly ever cracked a book and when he arrived at college he struggled his first year because of the huge gap. I am very happy and relieved to report he will be graduating soon! All three of our older kids attended Public Schools and graduated. One out of the three did not because of falling through the cracks and the Public Schools giving up on him.

Times are changing and Public Schools are not necessarily the answer for ALL kids. Homeschoolers are held to high standards by the state as well just not in the same ways. They are able to be taught a well rounded education instead of one that is centered around one yearly test. Our government has taken the joy out of learning for our kids in Public Schools. They are merely computers with the goverment dictating what information they want to be inputed!

Homeschooling will only gain more and more popularity as more and more Public Schools have to shut down due to lack of funds or because parents get tired of the conflict of morals between the Public Schools and home. I have already run into that with our late in life suprise blessing. We have always taught our kids to use Yes Mame/Sir, no thank you, etc. A young teacher told our son that he did not have to say yes Mame...may not be a biggie to some but it really rubbed me the wrong way. There are some of us out here that are from the olds school where such politeness is still an important part of life and are trying to pass it on and keep it going!

[grumpy]

Imam88 what you say certainly makes sense. It was quite some time ago. I have grandchildren in the Houston school system, very good area, who seem to be learning what they should and being prepared for college. However I also have grandchildren in Dallas who attend the Richardson school system and I wonder about that. Due to busing and other government mandates they go to school with kids who are not from their neighborhoods. I think there the quality of the education could be better. Of course a lot depends on the individual teachers as well as the individual kids. Also I admit I was not aware that the state had any standards for home schooling.
I agree with you too on the yes maam and yes sir, please and thank you, and other common courtesies we took for granted. Some of that may not be being taught in the homes either.

[Whoop]

I vote for Home school!! There is a major disconnect in the PS that are leaving so many children behind. College admissions are eagerly accepting home school children, because they tend to do better in college then their public school counter parts. http://www.youcanhomeschool.org/starthere/default.asp?bhcp=1 (http://www.youcanhomeschool.org/starthere/default.asp?bhcp=1)I have a cousin who is 22 and a aerospace engineer with a major corp. in the US, he was HS all the way through High School. I have another cousin who is a scientific journalist for a major magazine, she was HS all the way as well. She has a BA in some kind of science degree, with her masters being completed this year. A third cousin is going to be an art teacher. All three kids went to/ are going to school on full ride college scholarships. The link above states By grade 8, the average homeschool student performs four grade levels above the national average.
Socially they are more able to deal with the wide range of people met in the real world. Because if you think about it where (other then in PS) will you be in a room, or surrounded by 25 people who are your same age. If you give your child access to the real world they will get better " socialization" that will help them deal with people of all age ranges, and all backgrounds. More of a reality to what their adult life will be like. You will also be able to control what issues your child deals with, not to be a control freak, but as a parent it is your job to protect your child until they are able and willing to deal with certain things. I know riding on the bus I saw lots of things a young child should not see, or be forced to be around , and that was "back in the day" in MF. A HS dad once told me that if he wants his kids socialized he will corner then in the bathroom, beat them up and steal their lunch money. I bet we can all think of kids from PS who are not socially "normal" as well. So you can throw that example out the window. LOL If you google socialization and homeschool you will get lots of great book suggestions, and post on forums about this issue.
As for laws governing HS. Texas is one of the best states in the Union for that. The laws give us the freedom to do as we wish with our children, with little more then a basic guide line of what is required taught. There are always people who get upset about this because there is no government control of what is taught when or testing or such. But that is my FREEDOM if my kids were tested that would mean I would have to teach to the test and follow the PS schedules, not giving me the ability to see and judge what my child is ready to learn. http://www.hslda.org/laws/analysis/Texas.pdf here is a link that has the laws concerning HS outlined.

lmam88 (http://www.thehighlandlakes.com/member.php?u=2613)- I would encourage you to not give up. I have read that it takes some times up to 6 months to "unschool" a child. To get them out of the PS mind set. You might also look into things like learning types and styles, which would make teaching, and learning a lot easier for everybody involved. Also doing fun things while PS is in session makes the child see benefits of being HS. Like a Not Back to School party, or going some place like Sea World and not having to stand in line because everybody else is at school. ETC. If you would like to PM me I would chat with you or give you some more links for information. The younger a child the more easily their mind is formed, both positive and negatively towards school. This is when a child is learning to read, and starting math and such. Both are very important foundations to a life of learning.

[grumpy]

With home schooling, who is qualified to teach high school math courses and science courses? I am a college graduate and I would not feel qualified to teach trig, geometry, calculus, etc. Nor would I be qualified to teach physics, biology, etc. Granted if one of the parents is an engineer or otherwise trained in these fields, he or she could teach those courses. But not the average parent.

[sallygator]

I, too, vote for homeschooling - all the way. My daughter has been homeschooled her whole life. She is now 14 and I am amazed at how smart she is and the sane view she has of the world. Course we also don't watch TV or play video games! But that's another discussion. ; ))
Once you get into the world of homeschooling you will find the other parents to connect up with, the organizations and groups that have mastered homeschooling and are willing to help you, the amazing amount of curriculum that is available to homeschoolers, the list goes on...
I, too, agree that more and more parents will start using it as public education continues to deteriorate. Just for kicks I recently toured two public schools and a charter school. Upon arrival at the charter school, there were 4 police officers, in addition to the two working at the school, handling an altercation involving two of the students. The public schools didn't fare much better when asked questions about school gangs, violence and drugs. So, it re-affirmed my faith in continuing to home school my child. :cool2:
And I wholeheartedly agree that children need to be taught manners: Yes, sir and No, Ma'am...

[Whoop]

Grumpy- With the choices available today there is no reason to worry about teaching those courses. There are online classes, classes taught by DVD, and a ton of information and help easily accessible (and tons of it free) online. I am not sure about the local colleges, but there are several I know of that have dual credit courses where the kid will gain college and high school credit for those same classes. There are also co-ops and other groups around to help work through those tough classes.

As a side note, and not bashing current teachers. I went to college with a ton of soon to be teachers, and took many of the same classes. I have no problem in saying that I see no difference in ability of a mom learning how to teach upper level classes and a teacher learning how to teach it. My favorite quote from a teacher friend who had taught Kindergarten, 1st and 2nd grade for almost 7 years. " I just don't know how to teach my son how to read, how did you do it" I almost fell over. She was educated in teaching kids how to read, and in charge of that aspect of hundreds of kids, and she didn't understand how to do it for her own child. One bonus point to homeschooling is that the parents learn right along with their kids, we have to stay one step ahead of them. I do know and was taught by several wonderful teachers who truly loved kids and tried to their hardest to teach us.

[gardener]

Just a note, Ever tried to help your child with homework and been completely confused!
There is a lot more assistance for homeschooling parents than public school parents.

[Whoop]

Just a note, Ever tried to help your child with homework and been completely confused!
There is a lot more assistance for homeschooling parents than public school parents.
As a homeschooling parent you have the teachers manual, with all the hints and tips in it that a PS parent would not have!! Most of the material that I use is designed to be used in a home setting by parents who are not experts in that field. So they go above and beyond trying to explain it in simple terms so we can understand and teach it. ;)

[Dapperdan]

I have found a tutoring company that offers tutors in the 78654 area. They have profiles of the tutors and I can do a background check on all of them. WyzAnt is the name.

[carvet44]

I agree with grumpy - homeschooled kids don't get the socialization necessary for life skills. It needs to be an all-day experience, not a "play date" type of deal. But if you disagree and insist on homeschooling, by all means, be sure when they get married, if they ever do, there's a room for the parents to move in so you can continue to control their lives.

[lmam88]

I agree with grumpy - homeschooled kids don't get the socialization necessary for life skills. It needs to be an all-day experience, not a "play date" type of deal. But if you disagree and insist on homeschooling, by all means, be sure when they get married, if they ever do, there's a room for the parents to move in so you can continue to control their lives.
Yes, grumpy did express concerns about the social issues pertaining to HS but he did it without attacking, being rude and with an open mind.

[Caretaker]

I agree with grumpy - homeschooled kids don't get the socialization necessary for life skills. It needs to be an all-day experience, not a "play date" type of deal. But if you disagree and insist on homeschooling, by all means, be sure when they get married, if they ever do, there's a room for the parents to move in so you can continue to control their lives.


And just what Life skills would that be which these kids retain from Public schools??

Also how does going to a Public school even equate to whether a marriage is successful or not? h

Heck i would bet a Lame mule that the divorce rate is higher with those that went to public schools vs those who were Homeschooled.

[gardener]

A few life skills from public high school as observed were hiding to avoid being harassed by peers, running to bus to avoid clique fights, hiking up skirt to be "fashionable" and standing on toilet with bathroom stall door locked so the new bathroom occupants would not know you were a witness to drugs. And these were just the girls, some of the life skills picked up by the boys are much worse....
This from my daughters and sons.. The life skills they picked up at church were much more useful especially in college and business!

[grumpy]

I will have to admit there was a lot I did not know about home schooling. For that matter, there is still a lot I don't know. I had no idea there were state programs for it. I still wonder about the lack of social mix that will be necessary in life after school. The world has changed and continues to change. I remember when we did not lock our houses and left the keys in the car. Not now!

[Whoop]

Socialization is often an issue that is brought up as a negative to Homeschooling. After several research studies have been released it has been proven that home schooled kids are more "socialized" then those in public school. Meaning that the experiences that they experience are more like what happens in the adult life. Or to put it another way, more useful once they get out of high school, or meet the real world. Most HS kids are active in at least 2 outside the home activities a week. ( this doesn't include errands and such they run with their parents) But a "normal" HS is involved in 5-6 outside the home activities. They are better able to converse and handle themselves in public situations with people of different ages and status, because that is who they are around. They are not in an artificial environment of only their age peers.
Also they are not subject to the peer pressures at such a high rate as their counter parts in PS. They are able to become who they want to be and their individuality is allowed to bloom. In a public school setting those kids are forced to become "normal" or else they are teased and tormented. In a HS setting the child is encouraged to use their brain and are not made fun or picked on because they are smart, wear off brand jeans, or have a different hair style. I had this first hand, where I was teased and taunted because I would make good grades and the others in the class would not. I quit trying and almost failed a class because of that.
On a different note there are HS kids who are weird and socially awkward. There are HS kids who are not good students, and there are HS parents who are not doing their job wonderfully. But if these same kids were in public school we would blame the kids genes, not ps. We have nerds, geeks, freaks, and a whole slew of terms that label them. We don't roll our eyes and say " oh that PS is not allowing those kids to socialize enough" I have heard a perfect remark from a HS dad who said that he would rather have his children be civilized instead of socialized.
I have to question the statement about it needs to be an all day event not a play date. I do think that I have heard numerous times that " now is not the time to socialize" said by a PS teacher. If I remember correctly that "school time is for learning" and "you can talk during lunch not during class". All of these are things that mean socialization in the PS is suppose to only happen during the 1 hour break the kids have. Which would mean that yes it is a short "play date" type activity. I also wonder why it would be that a child has to be subject to 20 other like age playmates to learn how to be a child? If it is that the HS child needs to be around the PS children then all those after school and weekend sports or clubs would show that that is happening as well.
To answer the remark about the parent controlling the life of the child. I would ask who's job is it to take care of and raise the children. Is it not the parents? Just because a child is HS doesn't mean that the parent controls each and every move the child makes. We are in control of what is taught to the child. Yes that is a good thing. That again is my freedom and right. That is also why they are called minors and have limited abilities in our governments eyes. But they are also taught responsibility, independence, and how to have a loving family at the center of it ( those things can be taught in a PS setting as well, I am not bashing people who's kids go to PS). I bet that the divorce rate is no higher among HS kids then it is in PS kids. I would actually think the opposite. The college graduation rate is higher. Suggesting that the kids do know how to make it on their own. http://www.hslda.org/docs/news/201008030.asp

[Whoop]

Grumpy I want to say thank you for having an open mind. It is hard to look at something that seems so foreign or odd and look at it with an open mind. It has been ingrained in our heads that PS is what happens. But that is changing with more and more people pulling their kids out and HS, it will become more "normal".

[carvet44]

I know of an instance, but will not repeat names, of a family who homeschools. One of the daughters applied for a job in Burnet and was told she needed to get a GED before she could be hired. The family would not allow her to get the GED because they disagreed with the "teachings" needed for the GED, that they were not properly church oriented. Needless to say, she didn't get the job, nor the GED. This isn't control? How does this help with life skills?

[tarheel]

Whoop, thank you for taking the time to write a very informative post. You make some great points.

[lmam88]

I know of an instance, but will not repeat names, of a family who homeschools. One of the daughters applied for a job in Burnet and was told she needed to get a GED before she could be hired. The family would not allow her to get the GED because they disagreed with the "teachings" needed for the GED, that they were not properly church oriented. Needless to say, she didn't get the job, nor the GED. This isn't control? How does this help with life skills?
That is discrimination.

[butchkemper]

If the job requirements are high school diploma or a GED and the girl did not meet the requirements, then there is no discrimination.

The question to be answered is what document does a Home School student have when they complete their education?

Butch

[Peaches]

If you're going to home-school your children and you want them to be able to get into college or be able to get jobs, you need to make sure you're involved with an accredited home-school program. I've never had any desire to home-school, but my understanding is that home-schooling materials are available through local school districts. Once the student successfully completes the requirements, a diploma is issued.

[Caretaker]

What i find interesting is that at one time. A job application only had a on it the question. do you have a HS Diploma or Equivalent.

I had a neighbor who homeschooled all her kids.Her eldest decided he want to be a Pilot in the military. He took their tests and guess what. He Became a Pilot.Does anyone think for one second that a homeschooler would be trusted to fly a million dollar aircraft if they were not taught properly or were not educated?.

If one puts their brain to work and uses it to the best of their ability, IMO is all that matters.

[lmam88]

What i find interesting is that at one time. A job application only had a on it the question. do you have a HS Diploma or Equivalent.

I had a neighbor who homeschooled all her kids.Her eldest decided he want to be a Pilot in the military. He took their tests and guess what. He Became a Pilot.Does anyone think for one second that a homeschooler would be trusted to fly a million dollar aircraft if they were not taught properly or were not educated?.

If one puts their brain to work and uses it to the best of their ability, IMO is all that matters.

What i find interesting is that at one time. A job application only had a on it the question. do you have a HS Diploma or Equivalent.
I could not agree more! Now days if someone looks down on a GED then they do not accept it when seeking employment. If one does not agree with kids being Homeschooled then they do not accept that as being a form of education either. It is a form of discrimination...IMO.

[Whoop]

When you home school during high school you are suppose to prepare a portfolio that shows that they have finished the high school credits to graduate. It should include work samples, class descriptions and hours completed. That is what colleges and places like the military take as "proof" that you have. You do not have to attend an accredited school to be a high school graduate, nor do you have to get your GED. There are also places online that you can print off a home school diploma, which is legit, because they did complete that work.
As for the girl that didn't get the job, she needed to mark that she had a high school diploma. If she had finished high school at home. That is legal and the correct way to answer that question. If the employer asked for her to produce her diploma then she would need to produce either her portfolio or her diploma. The question did not ask if she graduated from a public school. Just whether or not she had finished high school.
It also sounds like the employer was not well educated on homeschooling, or other legal aspects of that as well. If that was my child I would attempt to educate them on the way that home schooled children graduate. If that didn't work, then I would assume it wasn't meant to be and move on.

[lmam88]

Whoop, if a parent decides to HS and for some reason they have to re-enroll their kid back into PS how is that done? Since the kid would not have taken the TAKS how would placement be established?
Thanks!

[Whoop]

I am not 100% sure on that. I believe it is up to each school district (maybe school itself) on how to handle a HS student. I would think that they would treat the child just like one transferring from another state where there isn't a taks test. I have had friends enroll their children locally after HS them and they didn't have any problems with it. Those children were placed in the grade based on their age. I am sure that if the parent could provide proof the children could be placed higher or lower as needed.

[lmam88]

I am not 100% sure on that. I believe it is up to each school district (maybe school itself) on how to handle a HS student. I would think that they would treat the child just like one transferring from another state where there isn't a taks test. I have had friends enroll their children locally after HS them and they didn't have any problems with it. Those children were placed in the grade based on their age. I am sure that if the parent could provide proof the children could be placed higher or lower as needed.
Thanks, Whoop:).

[countryboy]

Bottom line is this. If any child puts their minds in action and wants to learn.They will. Doesnt matter if its HS or PS or private school or church schools. IMO Public schools are nothing indoctrination camps.